How to load setting file (tsv)

[paulw7613]

Does anybody know how to load a ‘tsv’ file onto their trainer?
I downloaded the setting ‘map’ from the trainer (rampa) using e-training which outputs a tsv file. I then changing the P values in an attempt to improve feel. Since then I’ve tried to restore the trainer using the default P values, but this results in a slightly different setting ‘map’ compared to the original.
I’m assuming Elite has software to download custom files to the trainer?

[Elite Admin S]

Hi Paul

The "send map" and "read map" options in the app should be used only if requested by us during an assistance.
I'm writing this to avoid other user to mess up with the map

That said, after changing the three calibration points, the map is modified to match those values.
The difference in the new map depends on how much you change the three point, of course. The more you change the values, the more the map will transform.

We do have some test program we use to write a map into the trainer, but it's no much different from what the app does when you change the three points. I'm not sure to understand why you need to send a complete tsv map.

Can you tell me exactly what happens with the trainer?
Do you feel that the simulation is not realistic?

[paulw7613]

Hello,
Thank you for your reply.

The reasons I changed the 'map' are twofold:
Firstly i have a powermeter and wanted to align figures from both units as best as possible.
Secondly I found trainer resistance increases to rapidly for slight increases of gradient.

Having completed a calibration test to align the units, I still found trainer resistance still increased to rapidly for slight increases of gradient. As such I restored the trainer back to the default P values. Comparison of this map however, with the original map shows some significant differences.

At what I call lower resistance levels (gradient) the differences are minimal, but differences increase rapidly as resistance levels are increased.
I assume the values from entering P values come from an algorithm in software/hardware, whilst the default are from some form of calibration?

Hence my question. How can I restore the default map and or custom map? I can appreciate why you would not want such info being widely available, however I hope you can see what I'm trying to do.

Regards

Paul

[Elite Admin S]

Hi Paul

Firstly i have a powermeter and wanted to align figures from both units as best as possible.

If you have a power meter, you can simply follow the calibration wizard.
Did you try? Is the simulation still not good enough?
Which trainer model do you have?

Secondly I found trainer resistance increases to rapidly for slight increases of gradient.

This is something that is not possible to change. The increase/decrease of the resistance in all our interactive trainers is made by an internal stepping motor that moves at a certain speed (that is controlled by the firmware, but it is constant). Of course if the resistance change is big, the motor will need more time to achieve the position.

I assume the values from entering P values come from an algorithm in software/hardware

Not really. They are simply three specific points in the map (so, power values).

How can I restore the default map and or custom map?

Well, I have to explain you some other points about calibration.
First, indeed there is a default map (a kind of "average map").
Then, in our factory, every single trainer is calibrated using a very precise power meter. The default map will be then modified considering this calibration. Let's call it the factory map.

If you want to restore the factory map, you need the original three calibration points. If you don't have them on a sticker on the trainer (not all the trainers model have them), you can contact the customer care and ask for them - remember to specify the serial number.
If you want to restore the default map, simply open the advanced settings and select "send map to the trainer"
If you want to do a calibration, you don't need a complete map. You only need the three calibration points (follow the calibration wizard).

[paulw7613]

Hello,
Thanks again.

My unit is a Rampa and I have the three default P values.

I have also tried the calibration wizard and found that during simulation resistance (power demand) increases too rapidly for slight increases of gradient (slope %). This could be a function of bad simulation compared to actual power demands when riding outdoors, but the speed of the stepper motor should have no effect on the power required. If the stepper motor is slow it would help with increases of demand and hinder during reductions ie smoothing things if changes are rapid. For slow changes it should have no effect.

‘First, indeed there is a default map (a kind of "average map").’ Ok with this.

Default map modified with calibration to give factory map. Ok with this.

Restore factory map by entering only three values (P), not ok with this.

Only three values are entered all other values will have to come from an algorithm built in the software or hardware else the unit will only have three levels. What I'm saying is the built in algorithm results in different map values from the factory map which is why I’m asking how to load a tsv file.

Hope this makes sense.

[Elite Admin S]

I think that I've not been clear enough sorry. Or maybe I don't understand correctly what you're telling.

I'll try with an example.
(Notice that I'll use random numbers, don't take them as real numbers)

The stepping motor has a constant speed. And it moves a magnetic arm.
Suppose that you have a slope change from 1% to 5%.
The resistance must change from position 10 to position 100. Then, the motor has to move the arm by doing 14 turns of the screw.
Suppose now that you have a slope change from 1% to 2%.
The resistance must change position from position 10 to position 20. The motor will do only 3 turns of the screw.

So, in the first case the time needed to arrive in position is longer than the time needed in the second case.
The bigger the slope gap, the longer the time.


About the calibration, the app itself will modify the map using those three values.
That's why you don't need a complete map to download to the trainer.
If you think that the resulting map is somehow wrong, please contact our customer care at [email protected] specifying the serial number of the trainer, the calibration points and the resulting map. We will give it a look.

Regards

[zeloviqyw]

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[piterly6]

I think that I've not been clear enough sorry. Or maybe I don't understand correctly what you're telling.

I'll try with an example.
(Notice that I'll use random numbers, don't take them as real numbers)

The stepping motor has a constant speed. And it moves a magnetic arm.
Suppose that you have a slope change from 1% to 5%.
The resistance must change from position 10 to position 100. Then, the motor has to move the arm by doing 14 turns of the screw.
Suppose now that you have a slope change from 1% to 2%.
The resistance must change position from position 10 to position 20. The motor will do only 3 turns of the screw.

So, in the first case the time needed to arrive in position is longer than the time needed in the second case.
The bigger the slope gap, the longer the time.


About the calibration, the app itself will modify the map using those three values.
That's why you don't need a complete map to download to the trainer.
If you think that the resulting map is somehow wrong, please contact our customer care at [email protected] specifying the serial number of the trainer, the calibration points and the resulting map. We will give it a look.

Regards

Then, in our factory, every single trainer is calibrated using a very precise power meter. The default map will be then modified considering this calibration. Let's call it the factory map.

If you want to restore the factory map, you need the original three calibration points. If you don't have them on a sticker on the trainer (not all the trainers model have them), you can contact the customer care and ask for them - remember to specify the serial number.

[unicron]

I know this is an old topic but I am having trouble with my Real Turbo Elite Muin B+ trainer at the moment.

I have two figures on my trainer on a sticker, Pa and Pb and I think these are factory configured but now I think my trainer needs re calibrating.

I had my Garmin Vector 3's on the trainer before and tried to calibrate it using the wizard but I almost killed myself during the second part of it as the watts were fffing crazy! It was like asking me to sustain a power reading of around 380W for minutes on end! I managed to capture two new readings of the Pa and Pb values and these were 208 and 420 respectively, as opposed to the factory 130 and 347...

I have downloaded the tsv into a zip file for you to see but ultimately my problem is that the trainer is reading waaay less than what my Garmin Vector 3's read, so Zwift is mega difficult now as even doing 200w I am almost dying, whereas on the road I can easily push out over 3 w/kg and hold around 260w for over an hour and a half or more...

I like the trainer and it's feel but at this rate I may have to change to something better, even though I've only had it for 2 1/2 years.

[Elite Admin S]

Hi

Please contact our customer care to solve this issue ([email protected])

Regards